BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

mgdoc8307 wrote:I've been talking with Hyperpro re: replacement shocks for my factory lower 2009 R1200R. They can not make shocks for me at this time. I then must assume that is true with all the other replacement shocks. I'm apparently stuck with factory OEM shocks! Oh well!

Who did you talk to?

The only difference between the normal suspension and the lowered suspension models of the R12R is the lower one has shorter shocks. Hyperpro is certainly capable of making shorter shocks for you - I have them on my R12R.

I'd suggest talking to Klaus at EPM Performance. He's the US importer - and is VERY FAMILIAR with fitting shocks to the R12R since we spent several Saturday's getting them setup just how I wanted them. He should be able to duplicate my setup without a problem if you want to retain the lower suspension (and gain full travel - something you lose with the BMW lower suspension.) Call him at: 732-786-9777 - ask for Klaus. Tell him I said to call.

mattbr wrote:

deilenberger wrote:Mostly correct. Works Performance will take your ESA shocks and transfer the ESA controller to their shocks. Hyperpro is working on a similar design, but dunno when it will be done.

any updates on this ? will it be retro-fittable on shocks bought before they find a way to do it ?

I asked Klaus last Weds - he said he will have info (and likely prices) by the end of this month. I'd suggest contacting him directly and giving him your info..

cool, thanks !

deilenberger wrote:

mattbr wrote:

deilenberger wrote:Mostly correct. Works Performance will take your ESA shocks and transfer the ESA controller to their shocks. Hyperpro is working on a similar design, but dunno when it will be done.

any updates on this ? will it be retro-fittable on shocks bought before they find a way to do it ?

I asked Klaus last Weds - he said he will have info (and likely prices) by the end of this month. I'd suggest contacting him directly and giving him your info..

Well.....I did it! I took the big plung and ordered the Hyperpro Shocks from Klaus. I ordered the Model 360 with adjustable rebound damping for the front and Model 469 with the the piggy back reservior and high/low speed damping as well as the remote Pre-load adjuster for the rear. It will be a few weeks before I see them and I can't wait to feel the difference! Thanks guys for all the valuable info you have given me.

Brent Slater
2007 R1200R

Hope they work for you Brent, I think you'll be more than happy. I'm a little jealous, and sort of sad that my bike is brand new and my wife would kill me for replacing shocks already... (sound of whip cracking in background).

Now doesn't all that great advice warrant ponying up for a membership? Do I sould like Chitown all of a sudden?!?

For people who either corner very hard or like a lowered bike;Ohlins come stock with 10mm ride height adjustment on the shocks for the R1200R;front and back!

Mollygrubber,

You know, I got so used to going on this awesome forum that I forgot you have to put in a few $ to help out. As soon as I get off the ship, I will sign up to become a member. I don't have my paypal account info here. But thanks for reminding me about it. Yes, I can't wait for the shocks, I only have about 7,500 miles and change on the bike. But I can't stand the harshness. Before I came back to work I was ridding up in the Sierras and I was on the small road. I hit some bumps that almost threw me off of the bike.

Brent Slater
R1200R

Received the WIlburs, and the hugger today. Hope to have mounted in the next few days. Picture to follow.

UPDATE 10/23/09 11:47PM
- Shocks to be installed Tuesday by BMW dealer (too many honey do's)
- preinstall wilbers photos can be found here http://picasaweb.google.com/cpr1200r/Wi ... 007R1200r#
- stock shocks in place: http://picasaweb.google.com/cpr1200r/Pr ... 007R1200R#
- Wilbers Installed: http://picasaweb.google.com/cpr1200r/Wi ... BMWR1200R#

fyi..The Wibers weighed 2.5 pounds more than stock


First Impression - firmer ride, but Now I just need to ride.

So,

i had a short email exchange with Klaus.

here's the dirt on the ESA'd Hyperpros :

You need to send in your shocks so they can swap the ESA components in. They're a bit more expensive as well. My understanding is that you're also sacrificing some adjustments possibilities (namely, compression) for the practicality. Then again, I don't understand the first thing about what's relevant or not here...

mattbr wrote:So,

i had a short email exchange with Klaus.

here's the dirt on the ESA'd Hyperpros :

You need to send in your shocks so they can swap the ESA components in. They're a bit more expensive as well. My understanding is that you're also sacrificing some adjustments possibilities (namely, compression) for the practicality. Then again, I don't understand the first thing about what's relevant or not here...

I don't believe the BMW ESA shocks have compression damping adjustments (but could be wrong on this since I don't own any.. standard BMW shocks don't.)

Are you actually "sacrificing" compression damping or does it remain a manual adjustment - just not ESA controlled (which would make sense if the stocker doesn't have compression adjustment - it would require a completely different computer/setup/driver/etc..)?

Doug,

looks like it isn't manual, unfortunately.

here's relevant part of the exchange with Klaus :

"is it possible to (manually) adjust the compression on the ESA'd shocks ?"

"no that is not possible. The initial pre-load has to be set at the swap of
the ESA components."

mattbr wrote:Doug,

Dunno who Doug is - but I'll answer for him

looks like it isn't manual, unfortunately.

here's relevant part of the exchange with Klaus :

"is it possible to (manually) adjust the compression on the ESA'd shocks ?"

"no that is not possible. The initial pre-load has to be set at the swap of
the ESA components."

Sounds like a language problem. Klaus is talking about the initial compression on the spring - not damping. There is no "pre-load" adjustment for compression damping. There is a "pre-load" adjustment for the spring.

I'll have to pass this along to Klaus for clarification.

Heard back from Klaus - and besides clearing up the confusion, he is making a nice offer..

As I suspected, no BMW shocks have adjustable compression damping. They only have adjustable rebound damping. The ESA pre-load adjuster can be moved over without a problem. It's a bit more troublesome to move over the rebound damping ESA adjuster - but it can be done. You can also order a shock without adjustable compression damping - and it would result in a design a lot like the stock shock. Klaus also noted that you can order a shock with the remote reservoir - which then gives you manually adjustable (high and low speed) compression damping adjustments.

From Klaus:

Don,
Thank you for keeping me in the loop. Please see my explanations below. Let me know if something does not make sense, or, has to be reworded.

I will have the factory guru here this coming weekend and we will discuss this in detail.

To have a ESA set available here for show and tell would be great, but probably impossible due to the short time involved. If someone from the list in the NJ, PA, VA, CT, NY area has a set and wants to send it in - I will reimburse shipping and offer a special deal on new shocks.

ESA adjustments are for pre-load and "REBOUND" damping.

To the best of my knowledge there is no BMW factory shock, ESA or not, that has adjustable compression damping. Maybe the Ohlins on the R1200S and perhaps the shocks on the new 1000RR.

Hyperpro already supplies shocks with a special shock body so that the OEM hydraulic pre-load adjuster can be transferred to save a few dollars. The problem here is that BMW has SHOWA and WP pre-load adjusters and both have different diameters. The Technology is already there so we can transfer the ESA pre-load adjuster the same way. The initial pre-load will be set at time of component transfer. The BMW pre-load adjuster (standard or ESA) is held at the OEM shock body with a wire or clip ring. The spacing of the grooves (only visible when the adjuster and spring are off) determines the initial pre-load steps.

The more difficult part is the transfer of the ESA "REBOUND" adjuster, which requires the transfer of the OEM ESA bottom eye, some new parts, and because the OEM shock is under Nitrogen pressure which cannot be de-pressurized, some special knowledge and tools.

The Hyperpro shocks at the rear can be ordered as emulsion shocks (same as OEM) with only rebound and pre-load adjustment, or, as reservoir shock with additional high and low speed compression damping. The reservoir has to be hose mounted because there is not enough space for the piggy back reservoir due to the ESA pre-load adjuster. The compression damping adjustments have to be done manually (clicker style) as it is usually done.

The parts are available for the R1200GS and ADV. The new K1300GT was done last week. Next models will be R1200RT, K1200S/R and so on.

More on this subject next week.

Cheers
Klaus

So - nice offer if you're nearby.. and I suspect the R12R shocks are close enough to the design of the GS shocks that there won't be a long delay in making it available for us..

In the near future you can add Race Tech to the list of shock suppliers. It is my understanding they are currently working throughthe rebuilding your shocks vs building a new shock exercise. In either case it will be built your way, and to your imagination.

Per the guys at Taxxion Dynamics Penske apllications are very limited because Penske Engineers and BMW Engineers have a low opinion of one another .


AND

per a less than year old Motorcylce Consumer News shock test on an RT...........It's all in the set up.

They tested Ohlins, Hyperpro, and stock. Ohlins won, They thought the Hyperpro was too sport bike like. All that being said they spent an incredible amount of time setting up/testing shock adjustments.

With all that being said................to paraphrase my Lee Park's Total Control Instructors most riders would be much, much better off with a $300 skills class than $2,000 worth of new shocks. (I bought my Wibers as farkles can a 3.0 final drive be next )

parkec wrote:In the near future you can add Race Tech to the list of shock suppliers. It is my understanding they are currently working throughthe rebuilding your shocks vs building a new shock exercise. In either case it will be built your way, and to your imagination.

The RaceTech option came up on the MOA Hexhead forum.. and while there was initially hope it would be a less expensive option than the Euro options - their complete shock (without hydraulic preload adjuster) was considerably more than any of the better equipped euro options. Just a FWIW - they'll probably be very good - but I can't see them being marketable at the price point they quoted people.

Per the guys at Taxxion Dynamics Penske apllications are very limited because Penske Engineers and BMW Engineers have a low opinion of one another .

Wonder why that would make a difference? Do the Penske engineers actually care what the BMW engineers do - or need info from them?

AND

per a less than year old Motorcylce Consumer News shock test on an RT...........It's all in the set up.

They tested Ohlins, Hyperpro, and stock. Ohlins won, They thought the Hyperpro was too sport bike like. All that being said they spent an incredible amount of time setting up/testing shock adjustments.

Do you happen to know what issue that was? I'd be interested in reading it, and don't understand how I missed it since I receive MCN (the US version - not the UK one..) I have the past 10 years of MCN moldering down in my cellar..

EDIT - now I think I recall the article. Moshe Levy did it (he's a friend and local) and he was using an accelerometer (measures displacement vs time) to measure the movement and speed of movement of the shocks. His conclusion was - while he could make nice plots - they really didn't mean anything conclusive (IIRC..) We discussed the shocks off line a bit, and I don't think he really announced a "winner". I'll have to dig it out. BTW - he did the article with the help of Klaus from EPM Imports (Hyperpro importer for the US..)

As far as setup - I normally try to dedicate about 2-3 hours of setup time. It has to be time where I have nothing else on my mind, good weather, and I'm in the right frame of mind to do it. I also always use the same route (about a 5 mile loop with varying surfaces/conditions.)

The payback is well worth the time. If it's the first time you've done it - double the time. If it's a redo of the same shock (say after having it rebuilt) - you can normally cut the time about in half (since you should have recorded the settings that worked before sending the shock in for rebuilding.) But I'd agree - without the right setup you're wasting money on a quality shock.

Wonder what spring they had on the HyperPro? I found for the rear I prefer a linear wound spring rather than the progessive wound one that is standard on their shocks. Either is available.. Both Ohlins and Wilbers come with linear wound springs.

With all that being said................to paraphrase my Lee Park's Total Control Instructors most riders would be much, much better off with a $300 skills class than $2,000 worth of new shocks. (I bought my Wibers as farkles can a 3.0 final drive be next )

If all you were looking for is control of the bike I might agree with the instructors. If you're also looking for better control AND better comfort - then they're fullabeans so to speak. No way the skills class is going to make the bike more comfortable to ride. I personally want both..

Have fun with the 3.0 final drive