Expert Advice Needed - Splines

[twindave]

I have a 2002, R1150R with about 10,500 miles on it. I'm planning a round trip from California to Georgia in the early part of June. My calculations indicate my trip mileage will be about 6,000 miles total. There doesn't appear to be any mechanical problems so far...knock on wood.

My question is: Should I check and grease the splines before making the journey? Is there anything else I may want to check besides the normal maintenance?

Any advice or input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Dave

[boxermania]

If you can wrench, as the job is fairly easy albeit tedious, but cumbersome with things to remove and wrestle, and considering that most of the failures have ocurred around 30 K miles, however, there are documented failures as early as 10/11K miles. In view of the length of your trip and the posibility of an untimely breakdown, I think it would be prudent to check/grease the splines, unless you are bringing along a chase vehicle.

Only for your peace of mind.........

[snowprick]

I have the same bike with about 18,000 miles. My clutch got oil soaked so had to be replaced. The level of disassembly is the same for your spline inspection. Anticipate at least two days and you will require extra muscle to do the lifting. Frankly, I would not bother at such a low milage.

Your call

[wncbmw]

I am sorry but I must disagree with my friend boxermainia. I think it is a waste of time and or money to do a clutch spline inspection and/or lube at such low mileage. While I know there have been some failures, even if some few were at low mileage, that just strikes me more as paranoia than prudence. Percentages are against you having a problem.

Honestly folks, if my confidence in any motorcycle ever sinks to that level, I would change brands.

[AndyRR]

Tough call. You might want to flip a coin. Ditto everything boxermania said.
The early (pre-20k) failures were WAY outside the norm for R1150Rs from what I can tell. You would have to balance the PITA factor of scheduling yourself a day to take it apart and put it back together at your convenience between now and June vs the huge PITA factor of possibly breaking down in WBF.
FWIW, I am at 35k and REALLY glad I checked mine this winter. '02s seem to have the highest rate of failure, although that may simply be because they tend to have the most miles.
Either way, enjoy your trip. Sounds like fun!

Snowprick - tell them to tie the rear caliper to the passenger foot peg. I did not remove the TBs and only detached the bottom of the rear shock. How is your wheelwell so clean?

[snowprick]

Snowprick - tell them to tie the rear caliper to the passenger foot peg. I did not remove the TBs and only detached the bottom of the rear shock. How is your wheelwell so clean?

Easy to answer, I live in the Philippines where labour is cheap but but good help is hard to find. When my bike is dirty I take it to the car wash where it is hand washed for 50 peso ($1.00)

[owldaddy]

Snowprick, how much is a San Miguel these days?
Don

[iowabeakster]

I agree with WNCBMW. You've got so few miles, that it seems like overkill at this point. If you are having some of the pre-breakdown symptoms (like bike won't downshift) then it would make more sense to do it.

Mine is going to get inspected when I hit 24K miles.

[sweatmark]

I'm with the others here - don't sweat the splines with your current bike miles. Our 2002 Roadster is just getting into the 25K mile danger zone, without failure (yet), and we've got a strategy devised for this season in case spline failure should occur:

1. Mrs. Sweatmark will ride her 2002 Roadster only when I'm on the 2004 Rockster.
2. If the Roadster screeches to a spline-less halt during a road trip, we'll transfer her stuff onto my bike and ride two-up.
3. If we have to leave the spline-less Roadster on some remote roadside a thousand miles from home, then we'll torch the damn thing and post the vid on YouTube, claiming the fuel quick-connects caused the fire and significant danger to rider.
4. Citing the NHTSA safety recall for the '02-'-'04 R bikes' Fuel Systems, we'll let our insurer fight for due compensation.
5. With insurance money in hand, we'll buy a replacement bike from another manufacturer.
6. If the Rockster's splines give out on the same trip, we'll torch it too, collect the insurance proceeds, buy a nice tandem bicycle and a time share.

Good luck.

<edit> of course, I'm just kidding about the pyromania stuff, Mr. Insurance Agent!

[snowprick]

Snowprick, how much is a San Miguel these days?
Don

About a dollar

[challey]

You guys are getting me scared.

I have 27,000 miles on my 2003 and since there are no symptoms of spline failure, I hadn't planned to inspect and lube things for this riding season. After reading these postings, I'm getting worried though.

Taking everything apart and getting it back together will be much more than a 2 day job for me. My weekend days are occupied until mid-May, so that means I can only devote a few hours on Sat and Sun, which will stretch things out for several weeks. I don't have a garage, so that means waiting until the weather cooperates. And things just seem to take longer when I do them. I'll be lucky to get everthing done in time for the Hungry Mother ride.

Is this really necessary PM for a bike with 27k on the clock?

Charlie

[AndyRR]

You guys are getting me scared.

I have 27,000 miles on my 2003 and since there are no symptoms of spline failure, I hadn't planned to inspect and lube things for this riding season. After reading these postings, I'm getting worried though.

Taking everything apart and getting it back together will be much more than a 2 day job for me. My weekend days are occupied until mid-May, so that means I can only devote a few hours on Sat and Sun, which will stretch things out for several weeks. I don't have a garage, so that means waiting until the weather cooperates. And things just seem to take longer when I do them. I'll be lucky to get everthing done in time for the Hungry Mother ride.

Is this really necessary PM for a bike with 27k on the clock?

Charlie

Of the bikes that have the misalignment issue, and the percentage is unknown / debatable, actual failure tended to be in the 40k ballpark.

Try the quick check. I haven't done this to an assembled bike yet, so someone please correct me if I'm explaining this incorrectly. Put the bike in 6th gear. Remove the starter (a 20 minute job the first time - it's behind the aux power outlet). Use a strap or tie-wrap to hold the clutch lever engaged, and measure the backlash on the clutch itself by rotating it back and forth.

Here's some possible benchmarks I gathered from my own and other's measurements:
New clutch / splines = approx 0
1/8" OK for now - keep an eye on it
0.3" failure mode. See pics in my "spline REPLACMENT time" post for what your splines look like. Don't plan any long trips.

[obc]

Have put 70,000 Km on 2002 1150R and replaced the seal at 40,000 and the seal and rear bearing (slight clicking when checked) at 70,000 maintenance so from my experience would say you are good to go.

[awagnon]

I had my splines go out on my '02 RT at 43,000 miles. Even so, I would just take the trip and not worry about it. Maybe you can look at the splines next winter when you have more time. Spline failures are still relatively rare, and even more so under 30,000 miles. My $ .02 worth.

However, I would be sure I have access to a good towing service, like KOA just in case. After all, other things can happen.

[challey]

AndyRR said

Try the quick check. I haven't done this to an assembled bike yet, so someone please correct me if I'm explaining this incorrectly. Put the bike in 6th gear. Remove the starter (a 20 minute job the first time - it's behind the aux power outlet). Use a strap or tie-wrap to hold the clutch lever engaged, and measure the backlash on the clutch itself by rotating it back and forth.

Seems like a good alternative. I have a question about removing the starter though: Do I need to disconnect the battery? I recall seeing that the lugs on the starter relay are pretty much open when I last had the cover off (to add the aux power outlet). Seems like a invitation for a disaster leaving them powered while messing around with the starter. While disconnecting the battery is not difficult, it does require removing the oil coolers to get the tank up - something that would add considerably to Andy's 20 minute estimate.

Charlie

[jas]

Seems like a good alternative. I have a question about removing the starter though: Do I need to disconnect the battery? I recall seeing that the lugs on the starter relay are pretty much open when I last had the cover off (to add the aux power outlet). Seems like a invitation for a disaster leaving them powered while messing around with the starter. While disconnecting the battery is not difficult, it does require removing the oil coolers to get the tank up - something that would add considerably to Andy's 20 minute estimate.

Last night I was able to remove the starter and gently secure it out of my way without disconnecting it. As long as your are careful it can be done safely.

[AndyRR]

Do I need to disconnect the battery?

Only if you want to take the challenge and excitement out of the job.

I already had the tank and battery removed when I did it. So I guess it would be more accurate to say 30 minutes to do it the BORING way. I suppose I also wasn't specific as to whether that time included re-assembly... now THAT would put the challenge and excitement back in the job.