Battery finally failed

[gel9001]

Hi,
I have a 2004 R with 34K miles. I moved to a new condo building in October, difference with the garage in this unit is that it has a wall that uses some brickwork to allow air in, thus its almost as cold in the garage as it is outside (New Jersey). When I get a chance to ride this winter, battery cranks motor slowly, never did that in my old garage that was completly covered. Yesterday it did same, but it started, got on bike and did a u-turn in garage to exit, then it stalled, now it wouldn't start. I will jump the battery with my car when it warms up next week. But my question is, is the battery shot? without going to a BMW dealer is there some way I can take the bike to a garage to test the battery? I don't know where they would but probes since battery is hidden, any suggestions? MY BMW dealer isn't so close by, maybe I'll just ride till spring when I can ride up there and ask them if they can test?
Gene

[jb44]

Gene, you're a lucky guy. You get to learn how to remove the fuel tank!

http://home.mindspring.com/~jabrooks/te ... emoval.htm

More seriously, if that's the original battery in your '04, it has had about 4 years of use... pretty good for a stock battery.

You can now upgrade to an AGM or gel battery.

jb

[CycleRob]

Cold weather really sorts out the underachievers. At 4 years old and with (assuming a worst case scenario) less than ideal battery friendly habits, the battery IS at the end of it's life.

You should recharge that battery without delay!! Leaving it in a discharged state accelerates sulfation, which coats the plates rendering them less effective.

.

[gel9001]

It is a gel battery and I bought the bike November 2004. Is there anyway to test the battery. Lets face it its a tight economy and if I don't have to change it I won't I would only feel comfortable with another BMW Gel battery. I know people buy the Odessy battery on Ebay, but there used to be an issue with the orientation of the battery posts, is this still a problem or do they sell them with adaptors.

Again, Is there a way to test the battery without removing the tank.

Gene

[boxermania]

Gene.....

You've been away for a bit, welcome back. Sorry to hear about your battery, I would tend to agree with CycleRob, but no one has answered your question......yes tere are ways to check your battery, but it must be charged to do so.

Your battery is probably 18AH to 20 AH, my suggestion would be to put it on a charger at the 2 amp rate for about 12 hours. To eliminate fooling around with the tank remove the plastic starter motor cover and get on the main wire to the starter (watch out as that wire is conected to the positive of the battery and is therefore live) and a good ground. Then remove the charger and measure the voltage between the + and ground, compare the voltages against the values below to determine your state of charge.

100% charged 12.65 V
75% 12.45 V
50% 12.25 V
25% 12.05 V
Discharged 11.90 V

Good luck........

[baltm604]

How cold is cold? Thick cold oil definitely effects cranking.

I ride pretty much year round in chicago. About late december I switch to lighter weight oil, the bike starts much easier down to 5F.

Bill

[jb44]

Again, Is there a way to test the battery without removing the tank.
Gene

Thanks Boxermania for answering Gene's question. Al, Please feel to correct any misstatements I may make.

Gene,

How were you going to "jump start" the bike with your car?

Through the accessory plug? Not recommended
Through the positive starter terminal and the BMW negative lug?

You can check the voltage with a multimeter through both of those locations if you are careful not to cause a short.

I don't know how accurate it will be because of a bit of voltage drop from the wires.
Best to test directly from the battery terminals.

But voltage alone will only tell you the state of discharge, not if your battery is good.

Only a test under load will do that.

Voltage at Depth Of Discharge

Here are some typical voltages vs. depth of discharge: (figured at 80% max discharge)
1% = 12.91 Volts.
10% = 12.8
20% = 12.66
30% = 12.52
40% = 12.38
50% = 12.22
60% = 12.06
70% = 11.90
80% = 11.70
90% = 11.42
100% = 10.50.

With 10.5 v being completely discharged.

I have a meter that measures voltage, puts a load on the battery, then measures the recovery rate. It is only accurate when attached to the battery terminals.

I certainly don't claim to be any kind of battery expert, just experience in trying to keep my dozen vehicles with batteries running.

Halfway down this page, Cyclerob explains how to jumpstart your bike:

http://www.r1150r.org/board/viewtopic.p ... lug#p81372

jb

[jfslater98]

Would the BMW trickle charger work at this point?

[jb44]

Would the BMW trickle charger work at this point?

Gene said his battery slowly cranked the engine. So I think a charge is worth a try.

Boxermania suggested a 2 amp charge for 12 hours.

I believe the new BMW chargers are rated for gel batteries (check before using). Gel batteries like a low, slow charge. My chart says c/20 (battery capacity divided by 20) 20 ah / 20 would equal 1 amp.

As Cyclerob said, if the battery is left in a discharged state for an extended period of time, it will sulfate and most likely will not be recoverable.

There are some chargers that claim to reverse the sulfating process. I have an Optimate 3 that claims to do so, but I have never used it on a gel battery (never had a gel battery, I know... then shut up and let someone who knows what they are talking about answer).

IMO and experience, if you get 3-4 years of use out of a battery, you are doing good. My last 3 battery purchases have been AGM batteries, which I am hoping to get more than that.

jb

[Beemeridian]

34

[rdsmith3]

Isn't attempting CPR on this battery just delaying the inevitable? As has been pointed out, four years is an average life span for this type of battery in a motorcycle application. Gel was lucky that his battery failed at home. Why would you want to risk it failing at an inconvenient place or an inconvenient time? If finances allow, it seems like it is time to just buy a new battery.

[pebmr]

Gene:

I just picked up my bike last week, and the battery was dead. I was able to recharge it by simply hooking the jumper clamps directly to the terminals without removing the tank. The positive terminal was a bit tricky, but the clamp made contact and I charged the batter. After that, I finally found the accessory outlet, and continued charging through that-much easier. I returned the Battery Tender to my coworker, and now will buy one soon.

[Beemeridian]

55

[gel9001]

Beemeridian,
You wrote "considering that it does not appear to have been cared for"
I never said I mistreated my battery. I think quite the contrary. I ride quite often, don't have any accesories. This is the first winter in a new garage, thats pretty cold and there haven't been to many riding opportunities to keep the battery charged. So if any, that would be the state of "mistreatment". The other thing affecting might be that this winter I didn't switch to 10w40 which I always did. Last spring I put in Mobil 1 synthetic 5w 50 or something like that.

I really feel that the problem stems from the cold temps we're having in the Northeast this year and the fact that the bike is not in as warm as a garage as it used to be. Today I jumped the battery using the external post and it roared right up. I drove 20 minutes to work @ high revs and feel confident that it will restart @ 5:00 when i leave tonight. I think that this Gel battery will last between 4 to 5 years. next winter I will probably buy a trickle charger. If it is indeed failing I think it will show some symptoms first before it does die. At sign of the first symptom will replace with another gel.

thanks,

Gene

[Beemeridian]

21

[rdsmith3]

I really feel that the problem stems from the cold temps we're having in the Northeast this year and the fact that the bike is not in as warm as a garage as it used to be.

I have read, but don't know for sure, that hot temperatures are also hard on a battery. Something to think about.

[boxermania]

When I was a few years younger I actually enjoyed push starting a bike......of course they had a magneto and wre anywhere from from 50cc to 125 cc, anything larger than that became somewhat of an effort unless there was a happy hill close by.

I would not even dream of doing that today with an R as the front page of the local paper would read: " Motorcyclist crashes against mailbox while attempting to push start and jump on his bike" The motorcyclist suffered minor scratches mitigated by the riding gear and the full face helmet not nearly as large as those on his ego and requested that his name not be disclosed to protect the innocent. The mailbox was totally destroyed and the USPS will tender a replacement bill for $1200. In lieu of the freaky accident the USPS has extended the offer to the motorcyclist to paint the mailbox the color of his bike....Atlanta Blue......

[CycleRob]

The Vector charger seems like a great do-it-all, know-it-all unit. I found the best price, $72.08 here: http://www.directdepot.net/product_info ... ts_id=1719 Even in the shopping cart pre-checkout stage, no mention of shipping cost was made, so . . . . .

About push starting the 50R, I can do it anytime I want from my driveway. It's a steep downhill to the street, which is also a steep downhill. I put the bike in 3rd gear then back it up (roll backward, clutch out) to the backside of the compression stroke. That allows crankshaft rotational momentum before it hits the next compression stroke when it turns the right way, making it less likely to chirp or skid the rear tire. I get a fast running speed equivalent at the end of my driveway, turn left and wait a few seconds for like 20mph, turn on the key then quickly feed out the clutch (still in 3rd). After the bike's cold winter 3 week nap, I'll get oil pressure on the spinning engine's key on slow decel before I roll the throttle on and light the fire. It's anal mechanics nirvana.


.

[Beemeridian]

23

[towerworker]

I wonder if I can push my bike while on crutches?



Glad I got a tender.


Wayne