Airhead for oilhead?

[R100Pilot]

This forum looks like a good place to ask my dumb question, so I hope y'all can bear with me

I have a lot of years riding airheads, first an R90/6, and currently an 84 R100RS, with an "S" fairing rather than the stock one, 48K on the clock, not bad shape, but it is a little old and has all the airhead quirks - lousy charging system, archaic suspension, lame brakes, lots of shaft effect. On the plus side, it's reliable, simple, and after a couple of decades with 'em, I know my way around airheads pretty well.

I now have the opportunity to get an 02 R1150R, with hard bags (good), bar risers (don't care for 'em) and heated grips, but I'm pretty sure it's a non ABS model. It has 32K on it and the asking price is $5K.

If I got it, I'd probably have to sell the airhead, on accounta I have two other bikes (a couple of new Triumphs: Speed Triple and TT600). The BMW is my "pickup truck," my main transportation. I'm just not sure I'm ready to make the leap from air to oil.

Any thoughts?

[ray82609]

I've never had an airhead so I can't compare, but I don't find the oilhead hard at all to maintain.
-Ray

[andy wynne]

I had an R80RT 1983- an ok bike, since that went a fair few others-Japanese and Italian and at the moment an R1150R without ABS. Go for it, what have you got to loose?I've had no problems with mine, and apart from changing the battery thats been it.

[mcollect]

I have a R100S, a MG Le Mans l, and The RR. The R1150R has non ABS brakes and they stop better then any other bike I have ever owned. Suspension is much better on the oilhead as is comfort and performance. They are both totally reliable and excellent "Jeeps", but the RR also thinks it is a sport bike and sometimes a touring bike. You can't go wrong with the RR. My $.02

[VABeachBMW]

I had a R90/6 back when it was new. Many bikes in between. Current ride is '02 nonABS. I think if you are looking for reliable transportation, go for it. The newer bike will almost always be better, especially in the areas you mentioned were weak in the airhead (electrics, suspension). Working on an oilhead is no harder than the airhead for normal maintenance. Just a few new tricks to learn and this board is the perfect place for help. My.02

[MikeCam]

The price for the '02 non-ABS is pretty good. Depending on the condition and how it was cared for, you'd be getting a more modern engine than the Airhead - better metallurgy, improved fit and finish, oil cooling, a whopping 700 watt 14v 50 amp alternator (or just maybe the honkin' strong 840 watt 60 amp alt.) and the Motronic 2.4a fuel injection system (mixed experiences with surge and lean mix) but it meets Euro II and CARB standards. Bigger brakes (the EVO part of the system at 12.6" dual front 4 piston Brembo's and 10.6 inch 2 piston rear) and nicer wheels and tire choices. Gertrang 6 speed transmission and the same old dry clutch (but bigger), a vastly changed paralever. Same easy care valves, simple throttle bodies, adjustable suspension (damping front and pre-load/damping rear), loads of highly stylish looks on the David Robb design (especially the telelever wishbone and the BEAK!).

And you'd be giving up a classic, easy livin', status producing bike for all that modern stuff.

[OU812]

I had this one, and loved it!

[Sparky]

This forum looks like a good place to ask my dumb question, so I hope y'all can bear with me

I have a lot of years riding airheads, first an R90/6, and currently an 84 R100RS, with an "S" fairing rather than the stock one, 48K on the clock, not bad shape, but it is a little old and has all the airhead quirks - lousy charging system, archaic suspension, lame brakes, lots of shaft effect. On the plus side, it's reliable, simple, and after a couple of decades with 'em, I know my way around airheads pretty well.

I now have the opportunity to get an 02 R1150R, with hard bags (good), bar risers (don't care for 'em) and heated grips, but I'm pretty sure it's a non ABS model. It has 32K on it and the asking price is $5K.

If I got it, I'd probably have to sell the airhead, on accounta I have two other bikes (a couple of new Triumphs: Speed Triple and TT600). The BMW is my "pickup truck," my main transportation. I'm just not sure I'm ready to make the leap from air to oil.

Any thoughts?

I think it's going to depend on just how much of an airhead you already are. There is a certain character to airheads that simply are not present on more modern bikes -- they have a less refined, more mechanical feel to them.

I guess I would make an analogy between airhead aficionados and fans of old air-cooled VWs. For those people, VW stopped making real cars in 1975 with the introduction of the water-cooled Rabbit. Doesn't matter that the Rabbit was far superior in every way -- it still wasn't a real VW.

The R1150R will be a superior ride in every way (but be sure to test ride the bike to see if it surges). But whether you will like it as much is a completely open question.

[Mike S]

I have an '02 R1150R and a 1982 R100, and previously had a 1996 R90. The R100 is more fun on twisty roads and the like, but I like all the comfort creatures and stability of the Oilhead. Also, the breaks are SO MUCH BETTER! (mine is the ABS model).

My son and I took a 6,500 mile trip this summer - he on the Airhead (he thinks of the Oilhead as a "Geezercycle"), and me on the Geezercycle. We did a fair amount of miles on rough gravel roads. Both bike did great, the only glitch being a flat tire on the Airhead. But when we got home and I did the post-ride check-ups, here's what I found. The Oilhead was in great shape. No loose bolts, nothing was broken, no leaks. But - the airhead was a mess. Oil was leaking from the pushrod tubes, the final drive, the neutral switch, and then I stopped counting. The front fender was loose because the bolts had come loose and the square shanks had rounded out the holes in the fender. There were several other similar problems. I now have the bike half dismantled to do repairs.

So far routine maintenance on both bikes has been about the same. It's easier to change the oil filter on the Oilhead, but the valves are a little easier to adjust on the Airhead. Spline lubes are a PIA on the Airhead. I've not yet tried it on the Oilhead. The Oilhead seems to use a little more oil, but not much.

The Oilhead is not quite as nimble as the Airhead, but I've found that with experience, it does just fine on twisties. I can't quite keep up with my son when he's riding the R100, but I can easily pass any Harley and most other bikes.

I plan to keep and ride both, but if I had to choose, I'd pick the R1150R for the stability on the road, the creature comforts, and safety. But I'd sure miss the R100 on the twisties.

By the way, both bikes got the same mileage - 40 MPG - on our trip. Go figure.

[dcameron]

The price for the '02 non-ABS is pretty good. Depending on the condition and how it was cared for, you'd be getting a more modern engine than the Airhead - better metallurgy, improved fit and finish, oil cooling, a whopping 700 watt 14v 50 amp alternator (or just maybe the honkin' strong 840 watt 60 amp alt.) and the Motronic 2.4a fuel injection system (mixed experiences with surge and lean mix) but it meets Euro II and CARB standards. Bigger brakes (the EVO part of the system at 12.6" dual front 4 piston Brembo's and 10.6 inch 2 piston rear) and nicer wheels and tire choices. Gertrang 6 speed transmission and the same old dry clutch (but bigger), a vastly changed paralever. Same easy care valves, simple throttle bodies, adjustable suspension (damping front and pre-load/damping rear), loads of highly stylish looks on the David Robb design (especially the telelever wishbone and the BEAK!).

And you'd be giving up a classic, easy livin', status producing bike for all that modern stuff.

Well said - the newer R is a great bike. i got an 03 non ABS 2 years ago and it continues to impress me. i'm not a dyi guy anymore but my mechanic swears it is the best of all the beemers. i can only concur BTW he has an airhead

[CycleRob]

I've ridden and worked on my brother-inlaw Ken's copper colored R90S when he had it years ago. Riding it, and working on it too, shouted to me "1950's tractor". I remember dancing around the danger of shorting out the exposed diode bank on the anemic, undersized, red lite on at idle, alternator. Then there was the breaker points cleaning and setting. I introduced Ken to my xenon strobe inductive pickup timing lite and mercury carb styx that both easily set things from really bad to perfect. The one thing I liked was the bike's kickstart, which was often needed with his heated vest, short trips and old battery.

My 2002 R1150R has over 58,400 miles with only headlite and license lite bulb failures.

The OilHead makes about twice the HP of the AirHead and it's overall performance capabilities are a quantum leap over the AirHead's. Plus, the only time you will see or smell fuel is when you gas it up. My bike still pushes 14V at 1,200 RPM (Winter) idle with the heated grips on high, a Widder vest AND a pair of 55W driving lites on.

UpGrade!!! Say goodbye to weepy temperamental carburetors, mushy forks, brake dive, dangerous brakes and the 1950's technology. Your wrenching skills will make the OilHead one of the cheapest bikes to own & maintain. You will end up appreciating & loving the R1150R like a really good wife. I know this. I have both.

[R100Pilot]

Thanks for all the helpful info so far!

I really am sitting on the fence, about 50/50.

So what's this rumor about clutch splines going bad on oilheads? And the "surge." Are these just some over-hyped internet things or has it been a real problem?

At least the airhead is a devil I know (oh yes, that little red GEN light haunts me, and I have nightmares about broken pawl springs).

[mcollect]

When I picked up my bike,used, from a dealer it did indeed surge. I read all the troubles about the single spark models surging. But also on this forum about how to fix it. I adjusted the valves, they were only.002 out and then used a pair of mercury carb stix to sync the TBs way out. After that time I have absolutely no surging. I think anyone that works on our simple bikes, and takes the time to do it right will eliminate surging!

[MikeCam]

The surge is real enough, but quantifying how many do it is at best a challenge. Generally, the 2002 R1150R had some instances of mild surging (none as bad as the R1100RT reported in the late 90's). Motronic 2.4a seemed to adapt the engine and sensors well to U.S. blended gasolines. The usual cures if it happens to you are these:

1. change gas - better blends yield better results unless you live in a part of the country that insists on selling bad gas (ethanol, oxygenated, etc).
2. Use Seafoam/Techron/other additive/FI cleaners
3. Valve adjust and Throttle body sync spot on
4. Check O2 sensor and reflash Motronic unit.
5. Pull the CAT Code Plug and run the rich mix.

Most Roadsters, however, experienced no problems.

Splines. Well, just as hard to get good data. Apparently, between 2001-2004 the German workers were 'angry' about BMW outsourcing many components and changing the way they did final assembly. So a batch of bikes were assembled at somewhat less than the usual high German standard. In these cases, the light coat of moly-grease needed for the spline interface was absent or poorly applied. At about 24000 miles of use (mainly U.S. experiences here) dry splines do exhibit signs of wear and failure. Not all, but enough that the Internet illuminates the problem. The solution is a DITY re-lube, but that is a more than minor undertaking while the dealer version is expensive in man-hours required.

Take some comfort that the spline 'problem' seems to happen more in the RT/GS models and K-LT model (due to higher curb weights, overloading, different spline angles, more rigorous usage?) than in the Roadster model.

[MikeCam]

You didn't ask but here are some other 'problems' widely discussed about the late model and current model Boxers (and K bikes):

Final Drive failure. About 5%. Mostly happens because the crown bearing is improperly made (an outsourced part) or improperly installed (requires a nearly perfect tolerance with shims and pre-load before final fitting during assembly). Seems to be related to heavier bikes and more rigorous usage (again RT/GS and K-LT) but does happen to Roadsters also.

Transmission failure. No clear % available. Two causes, unrelated. First, the automotive type transmission (tractor style) uses shift dogs to move the gears between 1-2, 3-4, and 5-6. These dogs get bent. That leads to eventual replacement of the tranny if not caught soon enough. Second, another batch of bad sub-components from a third party supplier that were out of spec and never should have been assembled into bikes in the first place. If you get one of those, it will eat transmissions forever until someone figures out the entire drivetrain units need replaced and properly aligned from engine all the way back to Final Drive.

Clutch. A wear and tear item. But nobody expects their clutch to fail too early. And these sometimes do. It is a dry clutch subjected to high forces. Many riders with experience in Japanese style wet clutches manage to destroy the BMW dry clutch very early in its life. Well outside the MTBF expected. Also clutch slave cylinders go out early in a few cases - that should never happen. But it does.

In summary: 95% or more bikes with normal user care and scheduled maintenance do fine. 5% have unexpected and exasperating problems that 'you just didn't pay $10,000.00 for a bike' to experience.

[hirsty]

If you are using the BM as a workhorse, I don't know what you'd do with the oilhead that you can't do on the Speed Triple? It'd be better over distance / pillion / luggage / touring screen etc, but won't be as much fun.

If I had a sports 600 & a Speed Triple already, I'd stick with airhead and spend the money upgrading to the 675... Or maybe swap the airhead for the 1150R and change the Speed Triple for a Street Triple...

3 bike combo nightmare!