I could have sworn I already posted a thread about this - but I can't find it anywhere (on any forum I inhabit!)
So - the "new" Rockster has a very whiney fuel pump, and power seems down, especially at higher speeds. The bike runs fine, although tickover is a little hesitant, but at 60 plus it doesn't pull in the way I'd expect.
This could be me comparing it unfairly with a K1200R, but I'd hope that after 13 years of Rocksters I'd remember what they're supposed to be like....
According to my factory workshop manual (R1150R-G), the pump is a "Bosch EKP-13.5".
A quick ebay search led to this: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BOSCH-FUEL-P ... 3665454202
which is currently 'winging'* it's way here.
Fingers crossed I will be able to disassemble the fuel-plate assembly without breaking anything and the pump will slot straight in.
I'll try to remember to take some photos.
Has anyone else had fuel pump issues in the past?
* in the sense of the last lame dodo struggling up the beach of life, attempting to escape the incoming tide of extinction, deliveries these days can take ages.
Fuel Pump
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Re: Fuel Pump
No but at 60+ it should absolutely fly like mine rockets. Good luck with the strip down.
Re: Fuel Pump
If the EFI doesn't have the correct pressure it won't run at all.
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Re: Fuel Pump
well exactly - i think the pump is not producing enough pressure.swamper wrote:If the EFI doesn't have the correct pressure it won't run at all.
Re: Fuel Pump
Probably goes without saying, but I'll say it: be sure to change the fuel filter while your there. How is the air cleaner/filter?
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Re: Fuel Pump
I've just done a major service, all liquids and filters. I thought the pump whine might be the fuel filter, and indeed it was knackered, but the pump still whines like a lost puppy.swamper wrote:Probably goes without saying, but I'll say it: be sure to change the fuel filter while your there. How is the air cleaner/filter?
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Re: Fuel Pump
Bollox
Bought the wrong pump
P/n of the original is 0 580 453 495
Damn.
Bought the wrong pump
P/n of the original is 0 580 453 495
Damn.
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Re: Fuel Pump
riceburner wrote:Bollox
Bought the wrong pump
P/n of the original is 0 580 453 495
Damn.
Hmm - well - I went ahead and swapped the pump in anyway, if for no other reason than it was a good way to figure out HOW to do the job. Surprisingly easy actually once I got my head around it.
Motorworks don't seem to like breaking up the entire assembly (https://www.motorworks.co.uk/vlive/Shop ... Q=TAT50461 - see their comments), but with the right tools it's simple.
Sorry I didn't stop for photos, but here's the drill:
Remove the assembly from the tank, making sure you note the breather pipes connections which you need to remove in order to work on the assembly away from the tank. (The breather pipes internal to the tank can stay there).
Remove the fuel line from the output pipe of the pump. I used a small flat-bladed screwdriver to loosen the crimp-clamp on the hose to achieve this.
Remove the electrical connection from the pump (easy)
Remove the outer strainer mesh from the base of the pump: To do with this without breaking anything, I used gently applied leverage to the plastic fitting with a small flat-bladed screwdriver and eventually it popped off. There is a metal c-clip type arrangement that tightens around a pin that protrudes from the pump body - you need the leverage to work this c-clip off the pin. Just go slow and gently and you can lever it off.
Remove the pump body from the assembly: This is achieved using a pair of plumbers pliers / slip-joint pliers or similar. The plastic ring that holds the pump in place has 3 clips 'below' the metal ring in which it sits - you need to depress these clips towards the pump body, while using the plumbers pliers with 1 jaw on the upper part of the metal ring, and the other jaw under the lower half of the plastic ring (NOT on one of the 3 depressable clips). With the pliers providing a squeeze - the plastic ring slides out of position quite easily. Just do 2 or 3 squeeze operations in different places around the ring and you can remove it easily. There's also a rubber o-ring between the pump and the lower metal ring, don't lose it.
In the immortal words of our good lord Haynes... "Refitting is the reverse sequence to removal".
The hard part is getting the damned mesh strainer on without breaking any part of the plastic lug. I ended up GENTLY using a large-ish G-clamp to provide the appropriate pressure to get the damned c-clip in the strainer assembly to go over the pin on the pump.
End result - although the new pump is still whining slightly, the bike responds MUCH better than it did, and will pull 3 figure speeds just like my old bike (ahem, on private roads, naturally ). I may still invest in a John Gemi chip once I get the rest of the bike sorted out, but I'm happy with the new pump now.
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Re: Fuel Pump
RESULT!
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Re: Fuel Pump
What you didn’t say was how much the pump robbed you and who supplied it?
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Re: Fuel Pump
Tigcraft wrote:What you didn’t say was how much the pump robbed you and who supplied it?
I got it from ebay- £35. As said it's not quite the right one, but it's working at the moment. If it seems to deteriorate at all, I'll find the correct one (they're about £90 on ebay or more) and swap it again.
It was this one: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/173665454202
However - these are the correct part number: https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw= ... s=HP17+8QN
It could be that the one I've got is a lower spec one (the price difference would seem to indicate so), so I may have to do that in the future anyway.
Re: Fuel Pump
Congrats on messy job completion. I've got a filter change in my immediate future - as much as I enjoy pulling the tank off, pulling the innards out is not fun.
I've been happy with the AF-XIED as means to revised fueling, but I don't know if anyone has done a side-by-side comparison with the Gemi chip. This afternoon I will put the 3rd tank of gas in Rockster2 since I installed AF-XIED, marking enough time & miles for the ECU to adjust. Did the same with Rockster1 with 20k miles riding following AF-XIEd installation. Oilheads really do benefit from the fueling change.
I've been happy with the AF-XIED as means to revised fueling, but I don't know if anyone has done a side-by-side comparison with the Gemi chip. This afternoon I will put the 3rd tank of gas in Rockster2 since I installed AF-XIED, marking enough time & miles for the ECU to adjust. Did the same with Rockster1 with 20k miles riding following AF-XIEd installation. Oilheads really do benefit from the fueling change.
Rockster#2, K1300S, S1000R (for sale)
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Re: Fuel Pump
Hmmmmm.
Bike is still hesitant across most of the rev range.
Thinking it might be the dreaded coil caps I pulled the plugs, see pics below.
Even though they're firing at different temperatures (by the looks of it) all 4 are firing well, so its not the coil caps.
Just checked the breathers as well and they're both fine.
Sooooo... it looks like I'm still not getting the right fuel flow through!
Going to have to see if I can afford another fuel pump I think. (the correct one!)
I suppose it could be the injectors, but I'd expect them to be an "either/or" (working or not).
Any other suggestions?
Bike is still hesitant across most of the rev range.
Thinking it might be the dreaded coil caps I pulled the plugs, see pics below.
Even though they're firing at different temperatures (by the looks of it) all 4 are firing well, so its not the coil caps.
Just checked the breathers as well and they're both fine.
Sooooo... it looks like I'm still not getting the right fuel flow through!
Going to have to see if I can afford another fuel pump I think. (the correct one!)
I suppose it could be the injectors, but I'd expect them to be an "either/or" (working or not).
Any other suggestions?
Re: Fuel Pump
Run a couple tanks with added TECHRON cleaner, may help.
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Re: Fuel Pump
Is that just an injector cleaner, or anything special about it?swamper wrote:Run a couple tanks with added TECHRON cleaner, may help.
Not sure if I'll find it in the UK.
Re: Fuel Pump
It's a gasoline additive, that's recommended by my dealer, it actually does some cleaning of the fuel system, injectors.
https://www.chevronlubricants.com/en_us ... eaner.html
https://www.chevronlubricants.com/en_us ... eaner.html
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Re: Fuel Pump
I stuck a bottle of STP injector cleaner in it today, and a tankful of Super unleaded (slightly higher octane).
Odd thing is..... the bike appeared to be running better BEFORE I did that.
Yesterday I also took out the vast majority of the slack in the throttle cable.
The bike is still hesitating slightly on full throttle, but overall it's much better than it was.... even though I didn't really do anything. Weird.
Odd thing is..... the bike appeared to be running better BEFORE I did that.
Yesterday I also took out the vast majority of the slack in the throttle cable.
The bike is still hesitating slightly on full throttle, but overall it's much better than it was.... even though I didn't really do anything. Weird.
Re: Fuel Pump
"Remove the outer strainer mesh from the base of the pump: To do with this without breaking anything, I used gently applied leverage to the plastic fitting with a small flat-bladed screwdriver and eventually it popped off. There is a metal c-clip type arrangement that tightens around a pin that protrudes from the pump body - you need the leverage to work this c-clip off the pin. Just go slow and gently and you can lever it off".
I have been fidling with this thing while swapping the fuelpump. The plastic clip and the attachement to the base of the pump. And the "sief" kind of pre pump filter, don't know how to call this part. It isn't straight a forward job. And where to find a new starlock ring that tightens around the pin that protrudes from the pump body.
Has anyone got experience with this procedure?
I have been fidling with this thing while swapping the fuelpump. The plastic clip and the attachement to the base of the pump. And the "sief" kind of pre pump filter, don't know how to call this part. It isn't straight a forward job. And where to find a new starlock ring that tightens around the pin that protrudes from the pump body.
Has anyone got experience with this procedure?
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Re: Fuel Pump
bMdeW wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 9:31 am "Remove the outer strainer mesh from the base of the pump: To do with this without breaking anything, I used gently applied leverage to the plastic fitting with a small flat-bladed screwdriver and eventually it popped off. There is a metal c-clip type arrangement that tightens around a pin that protrudes from the pump body - you need the leverage to work this c-clip off the pin. Just go slow and gently and you can lever it off".
I have been fidling with this thing while swapping the fuelpump. The plastic clip and the attachement to the base of the pump. And the "sief" kind of pre pump filter, don't know how to call this part. It isn't straight a forward job. And where to find a new starlock ring that tightens around the pin that protrudes from the pump body.
Has anyone got experience with this procedure?
I'm doing this right now on my 2002 R, and can't seem to get the particle filter sock off the pump. There's also a dimple in the metal sleeve that the particle sock attaches with. I don't want to break the plastic end on the pump that the sock fastens to but prying doesn't seem to help.
Open to any suggestions !!
As it turned out, the Euromoto Electric pump sock has a small dimple in it that allows the sock or "sief " to by pryed off easily.
Filter and lines replaced, no leakage.
What I have now on startup ( after resetting the Motronic ) is it's running on one cylinder. Suspect debris or clogged injector, or maybe I dislocated the throttle cable. NOT looking forward to taking this back apart.
Re: Fuel Pump
In stead of a starlock ring I drilled a verry small hole in the "pin" and used a metal wire to secure the sief.