BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

Well, some things...

I can remember when BMW was saying the K-1200-S was going to be a "Hayabusa Beater", too... And that didn't happen! Not even close...

My (then) local BMW dealer told me, and everyone else he could find, that the (then) upcoming R1100S was going to be so fast, powerful, beautiful, etc., etc. it would not only beat any Ducati made but would put them out of business in two years. What a prophet he was!

The R1200S VS Duc 999 speculation? Interesting Saturday morning fare I guess, but comparing a motorcycle that hasn't been made yet to one most of us have never ridden, never will even get a ride on, much less own? I hear this all the time at work from the squiddies..."when I get my Gixxer 6 I'll smoke your crummy R6!" "Oh yeah?" "Yeah!" "Well my daddy can beat up your daddy!" Gimme a break.

One: The BMW VS a true sport bike in the "real world"? Usually Beemer if there aren't too many straights.
Two: The BMW VS a true sport bike on the track? Fuhgetaboutit.
Three: Above assumes equal rider skills & experience, balls and desire.
Four: The old saw "A fast rider on a slow bike will usually beat a slow rider on a fast bike" was never more true.
Five: An R1200ST whooping up on a 999 in the twisties? See "Four:" above. I'm not calling the ST "slow" but you get the point.

Start generalizing about which bikes are "slow" and which bikes are "fast" and somebody is going to get a real surprise spanking, in the real world or track!

A copy of a post from Robert Foster on another site, dated Nov 12.

Greetings From Luzern,

GREAT MORNING HERE IN SWITZERLAND.

What abetter place to get a great feel for the newbie to be announced Tuesday. Had it out on the great roads here for 2 hours. And what nice roads they are WOW!

You will be surprised and conflicted. Although not the first time on the newbie. This is a shipping unit, slightly better than the one that I rode in the late summer.

Ducs beware for sure! Sorry Acid...but you have room for this one...errrr....I mean it`s brother to be.

N8, this new bike will give you exactly what you want and need.

More later.

BTW, this is a great new age for BMW. Their direction has forked to a new road (beginning). I am told today that this bike will have 2 brothers. Hint>CUP!

The PowerCup was so successful in the release of the >K....It served its mark real well according to reports read today. The K1200R is the hoter brother of the K1200S in sales worldwide.

LUCA bring your camera!

Hey, this is exciting...


__________________
Cheers,

Robert Foster

FOSTER RAD
Exclusive NA Distributor
LASER Engineering Exhaust Systems
Oakland Gardens, NY
[email protected]
718-468-4680

I think that I'll book a flight to San Jose as soon as they get their first R1200S.

My '99 R1100R is plenty fast enough to get me a HUGE ticket most any day of the week.

Still, I want something newer and faster, and I want it should be a BMW. I want (desperately) a new R1200R, but if I could mount bags on an R1200S...

Hell, in South Carolina, nobody can afford 999R's anyway. (O.K., maybe somebody on Hilton Head.)

George

[quote="PatAbout the Beemer -vs- Duc' argument:
My buddy has a race ready street legal Ducati, -AND- an 1100'S'......
The Duc' has more torque, it's lighter, faster, and has a higher top-end. He looks tough-n-fine on his ever popular Italian Red Duc' and matching Red leathers
- BUT -
on the roads of California, through the foothills, up & down the coast, and racing down our back-country roads, he's ONE HELL OF A LOT FASTER ON HIS BMW 1100'S' than he is on the sexy Ducati.

My point is this:
BMW somehow makes a machine/suspension that is easier to ride well under adverse conditions (anything short of a groomed race track). The Ducati is more at home on a track, save for the Multi-strada that is gaining popularity with street riders.

In the real world, on real roads, with equal riders...... I can see how this new rumored about mega-horsepower shaft drive "Rubber Cow" may in fact embarrass a 999R....... maybe.[/quote]

I agree entirely. I can average around 10-MPH faster into a canyon corner on my Rockster than on my Aprilia Tuono even though the Tuono is a much more capable bike. It simply doesn't give me the same confidence to brake or change direction, nor its suspension forgiving on the bumps and grooves on a regular road.

Well said by Sir Pat,

My point is this:
BMW somehow makes a machine/suspension that is easier to ride well under adverse conditions (anything short of a groomed race track). The Ducati is more at home on a track, save for the Multi-strada that is gaining popularity with street riders.

My point exactly

what I hear from you guys that are familiar with the both R1150R and the Duc ( I have to stay out of this, my track and other street bike is gsxr750, 2x faster then my R) is to me a matter of tuning! the Duc suspension is tune ( ohlins shocks dont hurt) for the race track and the bemmer is tune for the real world. I wonder what the R bike would handle like with the ohlins and tunes for the race track? mmmmmmmm

Just guessing here.....

an R1150R set up with really good shocks & progressive springs,
none of that servo driven heavy ABS,
some handlebars forcing the rider's weight forward more over the front wheel,

I would guess that an average rider taking this thing out onto the track, would surprise himself & others. But because a characteristic of the Roadster is for it to feel a bit "vague", I think it's likely the track would bite the 'R' in the end..... If you're pushing it to the limits that a track permits, your bike needs to be able to communicate things that the R1150R does a good job at smoothing over.

Up to that point, the Rock or Roadster would be fun...... but they're not good communicators and they don't do as well when you have to "work" them.

darthrider wrote:Well, some things...

I can remember when BMW was saying the K-1200-S was going to be a "Hayabusa Beater", too... And that didn't happen! Not even close...

My (then) local BMW dealer told me, and everyone else he could find, that the (then) upcoming R1100S was going to be so fast, powerful, beautiful, etc., etc. it would not only beat any Ducati made but would put them out of business in two years. What a prophet he was!

I have a model in my garage that was a Duc beater (but I have to sort out the fuel system)... it's an '88 Honda NT650 Hawk. Maybe not a fair comparison, since Kevin's Hawk was highly modified for racing.

if the 'hp' version does not disappoint, i might actually be throwing money towards one... bated breath...

...a big bore twin with sporting intentions (the 'hp' version?), coupled with the rising popularity of track days might lead the design team to conclude that a slipper clutch would be an easy sell. one can hope...

Pat said:

I would guess that an average rider taking this thing out onto the track, would surprise himself & others. But because a characteristic of the Roadster is for it to feel a bit "vague", I think it's likely the track would bite the 'R' in the end..... If you're pushing it to the limits that a track permits, your bike needs to be able to communicate things that the R1150R does a good job at smoothing over.

Up to that point, the Rock or Roadster would be fun...... but they're not good communicators and they don't do as well when you have to "work" them.

SAY WHAT???

R-1150-R Roadsters are "VAGUE"?

R-1150-R's are "NOT GOOD COMMUNICATORS"???

Where did that come from?

My R-1150-R "communicates" to me as well as any motorcycle I have ever owned, or ridden, in all my years of motorcycling including all the racing, both on and off-road.

Maybe you weren't bothering to "listen"...

Cheers!

Dallara

If Dallara slams Pat enough that Pat doesn't come back, can the "Patrick's Playhouse" forum be renamed the "Dallara's Den" forum?

Just curious...

Two things, Ofrogg...

First, I wasn't slamming Pat in the post above. I just really don't get what he is talking about. I have truly never found my R-1150-R to be a poor "communicator" or be "vague" in any way... Stock it is a bit underdamped, but that's not the chassis or its design's fault. I find it telegraphs a tremendous amount of information about the tires are doing, etc. It's a slightly different "language" than on a conventional front-end bike, but all the same information is there, and maybe more... since all the confusing flex and resonance "ringing" of conventional forks is missing that adds "static" to the "communication" line...

I was only suggesting that maybe Pat just never learned the "language", either that or he confuses "static" with "information". Nothing more, nothing less...

Second. I wouldn't want "Patrick's Playhouse" in any way, shape, or form. Personally I think there are plenty of political discussion forums around, and I just don't get it having one here... That's just my opinion, mind you, and since lot's of the members here seem to like to beat each other up in there I guess it has a place. I rarely post there, and honestly find the signal-to-noise ratio in there pretty low.

If Pat ever splits you can have it... They we could call it "Ofrogg's Liliy Pad"...

Cheers!

Dallara