MPG - A total let down!

[Dr. Strangelove]

And this may be a bit off topic, but I'll ask anyways. When I've filled up my Rockster at the pumps and gone to start it it just makes a whining sound, but doesn't actually crank. I'm not sure why this is, but each time I have flipped the ignition switch down and then back up again, and rolled the bike a few inches forward or backward and it has started right up on the second attempt. It's only done this about 3 times total I think, but it still worries me. Any idea why it would do this?

The first thing to do is clean your starter and lube it with moly paste lubricant you can get from your honda motorcycle dealer. And use enough, don't skimp.
There are lots of threads about this whirring sound and failure to engage on first attempt. Prob dirt and dryness. But it could be a weak battery also. Look for my threads on the trials and tribulations of my battery and starter in the past few months. Think I am good now though.

John

[Jpainter187]

You need a manometer to set TB, no matter how good your hearing and 6th sense is. Agree with Riceburner, it is easy to construct--lots of pictures around. The biggest "controversy" is what to fill the manometer with. I use ATF--it's red and thicker than water, not as thick as oil--works well for me.

Your mileage--if you are doing some really heavy duty stop and go city, rarely out of 2nd, lots of idling, those numbers are possible. I get about 50+ - on the highway, steady state, at any speed from 65-80ish.
Stop and go city---mid 30s to low 40s.

Get her on the road and see what you get, and the low fuel lite is too rough a guide for meaningful numbers, but mine comes on when on sidestand with city riding anywhere from 115-120 -> 125-135.
While riding, with a city highway mix, around 145-154. On long trips, steady high speed, 172-191.

Do not baby this bike. It likes to be flogged and will perform better. Also, some Sea Foam is a good additive every so often.

John

I have a manometer to synch the TB's. And yes, I use ATF in mine as well. If I can find time to get away I will try and get out on the interstate and see what kind of mileage I would get. I'm sure it'll be much better. But I'm mainly disappointed in my city mileage, even though my side bags are always pretty loaded down. It's about 13 miles one way to work, and maybe about half of the trip is speeds from 50-70, but there are anywhere from 8-12 stops once I get in the city. I normally keep it in 5th or 6th, just under 4K RPM when on the straight stretches of road. Then rarely get out of 4th once in the city. I have to admit though... if I go the back way there is one road with some nice banked turns that I feel the need to often take at 70-80 and accelerate all the way through. I can't help myself.

And this may be a bit off topic, but I'll ask anyways. When I've filled up my Rockster at the pumps and gone to start it it just makes a whining sound, but doesn't actually crank. I'm not sure why this is, but each time I have flipped the ignition switch down and then back up again, and rolled the bike a few inches forward or backward and it has started right up on the second attempt. It's only done this about 3 times total I think, but it still worries me. Any idea why it would do this?

The first thing to do is clean your starter and lube it with moly paste lubricant you can get from your honda motorcycle dealer. And use enough, don't skimp.
There are lots of threads about this whirring sound and failure to engage on first attempt. Prob dirt and dryness. But it could be a weak battery also. Look for my threads on the trials and tribulations of my battery and starter in the past few months. Think I am good now though.

John

Also, I found your little pictorial of your starter. First, I will go ahead and start putting my bike back on the tender every other day or so... I got a little lazy once the warm weather struck. And if that doesn't seem to help I will try your way. Just curious, how long did the removal, cleaning, and re-installation of the starter take you?

[Dr. Strangelove]

not that long. You have to lift the tank to release one of the poles of the battery, then take off the cover. Then you cut the tie wrap--you need to replace that--
There is a T45 (I think, or T40) bolt on the inside side of the starter that is a little finicky to get to, a 3" extension helps, a couple of other bolts that will be obvious and then you "deliver" it from it's resting place.

Need a workbench and there are a few torx bolts to remove to get to the guts. You'll see what needs to be cleaned. My rec is "ample" amounts of moly paste; don't skimp. But I am not talking peanut butter and jelly thick either. Not a thin coating.
You want to see it.

Then reinstall.
On your first try it will take you hour and a half? Two hours? maybe? When you haven't put enough grease and you need to go back, it will be much shorter.

You have to reset the Motronic after.

I am making it sound more complex than it is.
bullet points
disconnect battery
inside bolt will be invisible and done by feel--not that hard
enough grease
don't forget to reconnect the accessory outlet

[Jpainter187]

Hasn't made the whirling sound again (and hopefully it wont)... I've been keeping it on the tender at night.

Now if I only knew why my mileage still sucked!

[Dreamweaver]

Hi there!
This is an old thread but always worth a mention, especially if you are considering touring.
Just thought I would chip in with a few details of my own experiences with MPG.

I have a 2004 Rockster with 30k on the clock and recently did a 2,030 mile round trip from London to the south of France and back with my girlfriend, two panniers and a 55 ltr topbox! All stuffed with camping equipment and everything else. Heavy.

I have been concerned about petrol consumption with all my previous bikes and my R1150r is no exception. I took meticulous care in recording the amount of petrol and mileage for the French trip and am pleased to say that she returned an average of 49.73MPG!! The official book states that she can do 54MPG but I'm sure this down hill with the wind behind you. The French trip involved lots of open road riding and several miles of extremely tight bendy mountain roads with steep angles. I tend to ride quite fast and on the entire trip I was not doing less then 60MPH on any given open road, more often than not I was doing 80 or 90MPH on those extremely long and very straight French roads. There was of course urban riding through villages and towns but not much compared to the overall distance travelled.

Before the trip I was also keeping records of urban petrol usage just riding solo with no luggage and was getting 145 - 150 miles to a tank before the fuel light came on. This works out to be around 33MPG. However I was not taking it above 4k on the rev counter as there is no need in urban traffic. 4k is around 70MPH in top gear so keeping things at this level provides an MPG of 33 which is under the official stated amount. Not quite sure where BMW get their figures from.

I am 13.5 stone and my girlfriend 11 stone.
Hope this info helps

[Biff's R]

Sounds to me like the starter drive, or Bendix, as we used to call it, is on it's way out. (That's the gear on the end of the starter that engages the flywheel in order to crank the engine over.)

My green '04 Rockster delivers a pretty consistant 43 mpg. The bikes are pretty much all the same, so the difference is probably the fuel blend of your location or how active your right wrist is

RB

RB, You are not gentle with the throttle. I get about 40-45 mpg depending upon the day. I don't ride in traffic, but I keep the revs up a little.

[Jpainter187]

Hi there!
Before the trip I was also keeping records of urban petrol usage just riding solo with no luggage and was getting 145 - 150 miles to a tank before the fuel light came on. This works out to be around 33MPG. However I was not taking it above 4k on the rev counter as there is no need in urban traffic. 4k is around 70MPH in top gear so keeping things at this level provides an MPG of 33 which is under the official stated amount. Not quite sure where BMW get their figures from.

My bike has around 35,500 miles on it now. But what you've described here sounds similar to the mileage I get while riding, accept I'm a little heavier on the throttle on my ride to/from work, which contributes to most of the miles I've put on this bike. The first half of the ride is about 6-9 miles (depending on which way I travle) of mostly open road with about a half dozen stops lights mixed in. The rest of the trip is constantly stop and go because that's when I get in the city. I tend to cruise around 70-75mph which keeps me around 4k RPM, and then keep it under 55-60mph once I'm in the city. But I normally don't shift until about 4-5k RPM (depending on my mood I guess), and I never ride without two full side bags. I'm sure I've already mentioned most of this in previous posts, but it sounds like I'm not the only one who gets this kind of mileage...

I still plan on going for a long ride somewhere, but hopefully when my wife is able to go with me. However, we have a 19 month old son and a 5 week old daughter right now so I don't see us getting to go ride together anytime soon.

[Jed]

A couple of data points from my 2010 R12R with 15K miles. 65% of my riding is commuting (50% slab @ 80 mph / 50% back roads @ 50 mph) and the other 35% is spirited back road riding (wow, we're up to 200% already !!). I've kept mileage and fueling records since the bike was new since much of my riding is charged as business travel.

On my last tank, the starting fuel volume was about 5.3 gals (my normal "high fill" / US gallons) which yielded 261 miles with 0 miles to empty showing on the OBC - so approx 49.25 mpg for that tank. On my normal "high fill" the fuel is about 1/2" above the bottom of the filler neck. I figure my normal "high fill" as much as an additional .5 gallons over the rated capacity of the tank. I just refueled this morning - 4.8 gal to the bottom of the filler neck (so a normal "low fill") - I'm guessing the tank was very close to dry this morning.

Over 15,040 miles since new, I've used 318.6 gal of fuel for a lifetime (thus far) average since new of 47.2 mpg.
Not bad for a bike with this kind of performance not to mention that I'm not a particularly "gentle" rider.

[sweatmark]

On my last tank, the starting fuel volume was about 5.3 gals (my normal "high fill" / US gallons) which yielded 261 miles with 0 miles to empty showing on the OBC - so approx 49.25 mpg for that tank.

jed - since the Rockster is not equipped with OBC, what bike are you referring to? Guessing R1200R, in which case your results don't reflect on us low-tech R1150 folks, and especially Rocksters with short 6th gear.

[Jed]

On my last tank, the starting fuel volume was about 5.3 gals (my normal "high fill" / US gallons) which yielded 261 miles with 0 miles to empty showing on the OBC - so approx 49.25 mpg for that tank.

jed - since the Rockster is not equipped with OBC, what bike are you referring to? Guessing R1200R, in which case your results don't reflect on us low-tech R1150 folks, and especially Rocksters with short 6th gear.

RIght, sorry. R12R = R1200R

[Dreamweaver]

Those that are getting 40+MPG for their Rocksters, is this complete urban riding? Do you have the bog standard exhaust system with the catalytic converter making you sound like you're riding on a damp sowing machine?

At around 2.5k I found this to be the resonate frequency of the cat converter and it sounds very 'nasal and tinny' but returns to a slightly better note approaching 4k. I can almost feel her choking and complaining at this point and her acceleration feels flat during this rev range. She really only starts to pick up after around 4k. It’s like she is holding back until she’s allowed to ‘rock’ at 4!! Even then she is not as crisp as I would have liked.

I was wondering whether to discard the cat converter and have in its stead a 'Y' pipe connector joining up either to the original muffler or to an after-market one. I've heard some people say that the engine breathes much better once you get rid of the cat converter and you get, not only a more realistic exhaust note, but also slightly better fuel economy too.

Does anybody have any thoughts on this?

[NoRRmad]

Search around a bit. Opinions on this matter differ.

[Jpainter187]

Dreamweaver: I agree with NoRRmad, you should search before trying to highjack someone's thread.

Back on topic, I will finally be getting to take a bit of a ride this Sunday. It'll be about 280 miles there and back so I'll get to see what kind of highway mileage I'm getting. I will have my side bags on and probably a soft tail bag as well. I'll post results after the fact.

[riceburner]

Those that are getting 40+MPG for their Rocksters, is this complete urban riding? Do you have the bog standard exhaust system with the catalytic converter making you sound like you're riding on a damp sowing machine?

At around 2.5k I found this to be the resonate frequency of the cat converter and it sounds very 'nasal and tinny' but returns to a slightly better note approaching 4k. I can almost feel her choking and complaining at this point and her acceleration feels flat during this rev range. She really only starts to pick up after around 4k. It’s like she is holding back until she’s allowed to ‘rock’ at 4!! Even then she is not as crisp as I would have liked.

I was wondering whether to discard the cat converter and have in its stead a 'Y' pipe connector joining up either to the original muffler or to an after-market one. I've heard some people say that the engine breathes much better once you get rid of the cat converter and you get, not only a more realistic exhaust note, but also slightly better fuel economy too.

Does anybody have any thoughts on this?

firstly - do NOT try running a Y-pipe with the OE can if you use the panniers. I tried that and the exhaust gases were so hot they melted a hole in the back face of the pannier (ie AFTER they'd left the can exit hole).

I'm currently running the cat and a tip (no "muffler"), and I can get roughly 170-180 miles from about 18-19 litres of fuel.
According to here : http://www.torquecars.com/tools/uk-mpg-calculator.php that's about 43 mpg. I did notice that the overall range of the bike improved noticably after a damned good service (all filters, all oils, all valve adjustements, plugs, stick coils etc).

My riding is a daily commute of about 32 miles total, a mix of urban and dual carriageway, and I'm not shy about using the throttle.

Don't know if it makes any difference - but I've done the "filler-neck-mod" and it gives me about 2 litres extra fuel - so my overall range (with the 40-50 mile reserve) is well over 200 miles.

[grwrockster]

My bike certainly feels better without the std can & cat, the throttle pick-up is crisper and the mpg went up with Y piece and Remus revolution can with baffle in.

I get about the same sort of mileage as Riceburner at around 10 miles per Litre (sometimes a bit more, sometimes a bit less). I always reset the trip and generally put in 1 litre for every 10 mile travelled, give or take a bit. The trip reset and this average cons figure is a handy barometer for when I'm likely to need a fill-up, combined with the little yellow light (when that comes on I know I have at least another 40 miles to find fuel - never an issue here in the UK).

I think that the US Gallon is smaller though than the UK Gallon at 4 litres? So working in galls the stateside guys are going to show less per gallon than we do (a UK Gallon is 4.45609 Litres, so it's simple for me to work on the basis of 20L tank = 200 miles to pushing the thing. I look out for the low fuel warning coming on - if it comes on before or after 160 miles comes up on the trip, then I know how close I am to my baseline of 10m per litre or 45mpg).

So, my best ever 85-90mph (speedo clock fibs about +7mph btw) motorway cruising figure riding 1 up with side bags, box and tank bag of 227.5 miles range (though I still had a bit left) at 54.5mpg (11.988 miles per Litre) would equate to 47.9 miles per US Gallon. My 'typical' consumption equate to around 40 US gallon mpg.

[Jpainter187]

[grwrockster]

OOPS! Sorry - I actually managed to give wrong data on post above with a typo - a UK Gallon is 4.54609 Litres, not 4.45609.

Also the ole interweb tells me that a US Gallon is 3.7854 Litres, not 4 litres.

So, using the above data, my best of 54.5mpg (UK) aka 11.988 Miles per Litre equates to just 45.38 miles per US Gallon. My typical average of around 45mpg (UK) aka 10 Miles per Litre is therefore 37.85 Miles per US Gallon.

FWIW my mates single spark '01 R1150R gave pretty much identical fuel mileage over a 2500 mile continental tour as my '04 Twinspark Rockster. Touring and doing the Alpine twisties saw us averaging typically 48 - 50 mpg (10.56 - 11.00 litres per mile, or 39.97 - 41.63 Miles per US Gallon).

BTW, I can get the cons down easily below 40 UK mpg (33.3 US mpg) if I get the urge to hammer it snapping at the heels and harrassing Power Rangers on their sports missiles on a fast twisty A road. Mucking about like this will have the low fuel light on at 140 miles (compared to over 185 miles till it came on being a lot more sensible).

[sweatmark]

So, using the above data, my best of 54.5mpg (UK) aka 11.988 Miles per Litre equates to just 45.38 miles per US Gallon. My typical average of around 45mpg (UK) aka 10 Miles per Litre is therefore 37.85 Miles per US Gallon.

Exactly the fuel mileage range I've come to expect from current Rockster and former '02 Roadster.

[Jpainter187]

I forgot to post my results after my 250+ mile ride... Woops!

Needless to say, I was extremely disappointed with my results. The way to my destination I stayed at a pretty steady highway speed of 65-70MPH. I filled up right before I began heading home, and found out I was only getting 38.56MPG (if I'm remembering correctly). I told my wife I would be home for dinner and I didn't want to be late, so I was a little heavier on the throttle the entire way home... Running an average speed of 80MPH, and at times reaching triple digits. And I still showed to be getting around 37-38MPG next time I filled up! I thought it would of been much less since I was riding so much harder that second tank coming home... Don't know what happened there. Anyways, I guess I'll just have to live with the sh*tty mileage of my Rockster!

[crustyapo]

I just recently got my first tankful in my '04 Rockster that was over 40mpg (43.26) It is amazing what good mileage you can get when you restrain your throttle hand. But the bike is just too much fun to ride slow.